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Offline Asid

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Combat Mission Shock Force 2
« on: October 17, 2017, 11:31:08 PM »



Combat Mission Shock Force 2

From the dev, steve, posted 12/10/17

Now let's see, is there anything else to talk about?  Well, there is the Alpha of Combat Mission Shock Force 2 we uploaded for testers yesterday.  I suppose a few of you might be interested in it, so I'll take some time to do that.

Existing CMSF content compatibility?
Yes, the long awaited conversion of CMSF (pre Engine 1) to Engine 4 is well under way.  It's been in the works for more than a year already and, as expected, hasn't been quick or easy to do.  Pretty much all the artwork has been overhauled, the TO&E had to be rebuilt VERY carefully, and lots of internal data was reconfigured to work with formats which have changed multiple times over the years.  Most importantly, Charles had to delicately code Engine 4 to understand the old scenario file format so everything that was made for CMSF1 works without modification in CMSF2.  Thankfully Charles figured out how to make that happen, otherwise we'd not be having this discussion right now.  Continuity with previous content was a deal maker/breaker feature.

Now that testers have the Alpha in hand they can start the lengthy process of going over all the original CMSF content to make sure it works with Engine 4.  Then they will work on playtesting to ensure advances in the game environment haven't upset the balance of play.  No doubt most scenarios will require quite a bit of tweaking.

Current conflict?
When all is said and done CMSF2 will look and feel like all the other CM2 games, except with the unique CM2 content.  The game content, in case you are wondering, will not be updated to reflect the civil war that erupted in Syria after CMSF1's release.  We also have no plans, immediate or long term, to expand CMSF2 to other potential arid environments.

When?
OK, so when can you get a hold of it?  Not until early 2018, which will include the Base Game and all three Modules at one time.  When can you see something from CMSF2?  Way sooner than that.  We just have to, uhm, finish rounding off some rough corners first.

Price?
You will also want to know that Battlefront appreciates the support and dedication of CMSF customers over the past 10 years.  Especially in the first year when we all worked together to make the game engine solid enough to expand upon.  Since nothing shows appreciation better than discounts, we're offering discounts :D  The specifics will be announced as we get closer to release, but for sure it will be far less than theoretical $165 it normally costs to purchase a brand new Base Game ($60) and three $35 Modules. Though I do know for sure the discount price will be a bit more than a $10 Upgrade ;)

There you go... I've officially broken in the new Forum!

Steve

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Offline Asid

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Re: Combat Mission Shock Force 2
« Reply #1 on: October 17, 2017, 11:40:54 PM »

Price?
You will also want to know that Battlefront appreciates the support and dedication of CMSF customers over the past 10 years.  Especially in the first year when we all worked together to make the game engine solid enough to expand upon.  Since nothing shows appreciation better than discounts, we're offering discounts :D 
Steve

 :coffeescreen     :laughing4


That right there made me laugh...I think I might have peed...A liittle

Remember, they charged for the CMSF patch when Paradox stopped selling it............




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Offline budd

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Re: Combat Mission Shock Force 2
« Reply #2 on: October 18, 2017, 08:38:54 PM »
I'm just not sure I'm going to invest in CM games anymore. I have Red thunder and the total Normandy bundle and paid to upgrade them to the lastest engine and still have plenty to play in those games. I'm not sure I'd feel good about the post from BF, guess we'll have to see what the price point is for the total upgrade of CMSF but doesn't sound like it going to be light on the wallet.
Enjoy when you can, and endure when you must.  ~Johann Wolfgang von Goethe

"Be Yourself; Everyone else is already taken" ~Oscar Wilde

*I'm in the Wargamer middle ground*
I don't buy all the wargames I want, I just buy more than I need.

Offline Asid

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Re: Combat Mission Shock Force 2
« Reply #3 on: October 19, 2017, 12:29:36 AM »
I hear ya budd. As you know, BF are a very small team. There roadmap seems strange to me sometimes. My preference is for Graviteam titles. Battlefront make great games but I prefer the Graviteam devs  :thumbsup

I don't miss buying BF games  :happyhappy

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Online Stardog765

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Re: Combat Mission Shock Force 2
« Reply #4 on: October 20, 2017, 04:48:58 PM »
Because we expect them to give away or charge $10 for going to all of the trouble of updating  one  of their oldest games to the new 4.0 standard.  I see!

I know people love to poke at BF for how they do things but their community loves what they do and while I appreciate what Graviteam does it doesn't hold a candle to Combat Mission games for me.
But its a personal thing.

 :happyhappy


Online Stardog765

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Re: Combat Mission Shock Force 2
« Reply #5 on: October 20, 2017, 05:15:59 PM »
Let me qualify my last statement a bit so no one will think I am just picking a side in the comparison of two of the same kinda games.

The reason I feel the Graviteam games come nowhere close to Combat Mission is tactical realism from a commanders perspective.  I think they are great games but at their heart they are RTS wargames.
Now if they would offer the WeGo system of command then I might give them more of a serious look as they are beautiful games no doubt but for me WeGo and the option of PBEM is what makes Combat Mission of of the all time great tactical wargames.

Yes you can play Combat Mission as an RTS but you can also put ice in your wine but that doesnt mean its morally correct to do so.


Offline Asid

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Re: Combat Mission Shock Force 2
« Reply #6 on: October 20, 2017, 05:50:48 PM »
Because we expect them to give away or charge $10 for going to all of the trouble of updating  one  of their oldest games to the new 4.0 standard.  I see!

Nope

Remember when Paradox stopped selling CMSF? Then Battlefront wanted people to pay so that the bug fix patches, which they gave for free, would work on the Paradox version? That is what gets me.

I have no issue with a company charging for their work. However the Paradox patch thing was, FOR ME, Greed.

As for preference for developer and system? It is just that. A preference.


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Online Stardog765

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Re: Combat Mission Shock Force 2
« Reply #7 on: October 20, 2017, 05:58:35 PM »
Ya I remember. It was a $5 patch to convert the Paradox version to the standard Battlefront version when Paradox stopped supporting the game they sold.

As I recall there was also a difference in price between the Paradox supported version and the digital download Battlefront version.

I get what you are saying though.




Offline budd

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Re: Combat Mission Shock Force 2
« Reply #8 on: October 20, 2017, 08:38:20 PM »
I don't really have a dog in the hunt as i don't own CMSF. It does sound like it will be more than $10 and wonder how those that already own CMSF will feel about it, i'm sure we'll get to read about it :). I'm not sure how i feel about this upgrade issue and your talking to someone who bought some Command Ops modules three times and i know i will be buying the Campaign Series remakes.The third time i bought modules for CO i did start to question my judgement on the matter but i wanted to support Panther and i imagine the same thing for CM supporters. It's so subjective i'm not sure it matters anyway. Developers can price how they want and buyers can buy or not
Enjoy when you can, and endure when you must.  ~Johann Wolfgang von Goethe

"Be Yourself; Everyone else is already taken" ~Oscar Wilde

*I'm in the Wargamer middle ground*
I don't buy all the wargames I want, I just buy more than I need.

Offline Asid

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Re: Combat Mission Shock Force 2
« Reply #9 on: October 20, 2017, 09:08:36 PM »
but i wanted to support Panther and i imagine the same thing for CM supporters. It's so subjective i'm not sure it matters anyway. Developers can price how they want and buyers can buy or not

Exactly  :thumbsup

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Online Stardog765

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Re: Combat Mission Shock Force 2
« Reply #10 on: October 21, 2017, 02:28:26 AM »
Well I think you are right, the diehard fans of CM and especially Shock Force like me will pay whatever they ask for it and for others who just kinda like CM might not see it as worth it.

No one is really right or wrong, everyone has to decide what its worth to them.

I have no issue with them charging for it though, its quite a task updating a game that old to the new engine.


Offline Asid

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Re: Combat Mission Shock Force 2
« Reply #11 on: August 09, 2018, 07:50:47 PM »
Pre-order is live

https://www.battlefront.com/shock-force-2/

The price? Typical BF pricing    ::)

NOTE!!!!!!!  Pre-orders only at this time.  Discounted Upgrades for CMSF1 owners will follow after the game is released, therefore do NOT Pre-order if you intend to take advantage of the Upgrades!!

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Offline Jace11

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Re: Combat Mission Shock Force 2
« Reply #12 on: August 19, 2018, 03:42:29 AM »
I'm expecting the demo to drop in the next few weeks so i'll try it out before I decide but unless its spectacular i'll probably give it a miss. I already have most of their recent titles but have skipped on many of the expansion modules and still haven't upgraded all of them to the latest version. I did upgrade a couple of my fave titles to the new, so-called "Engine 4" which turned out to be the same as engine 3, with only contained a couple of noteworthy new features - one of which was a bug for their TAC AI which made units in cover run out and get shot. This was a year ago... they still haven't fixed that.

I read the forums at Battlefront and see people offer legitimate criticism of many aspects of CM: price, year long waits for bug fixes or their development schedule but the devs are generally silent and the local sycophants defend them instead.

And if you really want to enjoy the game its necessary to download a couple of gigs of mods/maps/sounds/user interfaces/terrain textures etc. They haven't updated the sound for the game in over 10 years... which is kind of shocking to me given the great sound effects that are in games today like Post Scriptum etc. I see their new version of SF still contains many textures from the first game, so I'm not expecting them to have done much with the sound this time.

Having said all that, i'm still a fan of their games and regularly play Black Sea and Final Blitzkrieg but find myself frustrated with the developers, which is ironic as I'm generally happy with their games, its just everything seems to take forever with BF.

Offline Asid

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Re: Combat Mission Shock Force 2
« Reply #13 on: August 19, 2018, 01:30:26 PM »
The problems and frustrations are still there for me with the CM titles.

I started with the originals but got disappointed with the company and its attitude. I will not go into deep detail but I will list some of the issues:

   DRM
   Company attitude towards customers
   Update costs
   Update methods
   Patch/fix frequency
   News/Press releases


FOR ME, Graviteam do more things right. I haven't purchased any CM titles for a while.

This is NOT a Graviteam v Battlefront post. They can both live together on the same hard drive.

Life is to short to argue with developers and fight with DRM  :Wag finger

Regards

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Offline Jace11

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Re: Combat Mission Shock Force 2
« Reply #14 on: October 17, 2018, 07:27:19 AM »