Invulnerable T.C.

[Asid]

T.C. will not die when out of the hatch. Same for HMMWV's.

Here’s the story.......

A few months back I realised that my T.C. when unbuttoned and out of the hatch could not be killed by being shot. It was as if he was not standing up even though when you switched to his view (F7) you could see out of the hatch. We tested this with Colebrook and Rotar and confirmed the T.C. could not be killed........Rotar reported this.

Fast forward to a few days ago. I was a T.C. in another tank Sim. I was unbuttoned and out of the hatch. I got shot. The T.C. died. I went back and tested this in SB and lo and behold invulnerable T.C. We did some "advanced testing and threw everything at him....Terminator comes to mind. Here’s a video Rotar made



•   Is the crew actually modelled in 3 dimensions?
•   Is the hatch actually still closed when it looks open?
•   Is the "hit box" not mobile?

Rotar has reported it to the SB forum...We await a response.

[assassin7]

Well here is one of the comments made by the Esim employee:

Volcano posted: "Well, not really -- basically there is no 3D crew, so there is nothing to shoot while unbuttoned. AFAIK, the only effect from unbuttoning is possibility of splash damage on the unbuttoned crew member, but even that might not be correct now.

As far as the hatch is concerned, it depends on how old the vehicle model is. Some vehicles do not have a hatch represented on the armor model, some do (the newest ones).

All this is known however, and it will take 3D crew to improve the current behavior."

and then
Rotar posted: "Just checked and being buttoned up does protect against HE artillery."

and then
Volcano posted: "OK, good to hear. "

This is what I think:
As far as I'm concerd and this is my personal opionion. The damage models on Steelbeasts are inaccurate and are quite far from accurate. There are many instances that I have came to such an opionion, this one is one of those. Another instance is shooting a Hind over 8 times with a 120 MM tank round 6 of those were MPAT Air proximity and the others were sabot. In the AAR report many of those hits show in the pilots cockpit and even the Sabot hits show in the cockpit. The player in the Hind at that time claimed to have suffered heavy damage but when I checked the report for that mission. The report only showed that the Hind recieved radio damage. I believe that the networking in mulitplayer may be bugged from the packets that the host and client recieve but really not sure.

[Asid]

Well here is one of the comments made by the Esim employee:

All this is known however, and it will take 3D crew to improve the current behavior."

It is news to me that you need a 3D model (crew member) in order to simulate damage to the model. It is some kind of "collision box" is it not? If this is the case then why do you need a 3D interpretation of a person?

I am unsure how to respond further. I have other tank Sims that simulate this feature correctly. Seems it cannot be done in this engine. Realism?
In the mean time you can travel the battlefield, out of the hatch and not be afraid of getting killed.

Realistic? No.
Immersive? No

Oh well.

[Frankie]

TC invulnerable? Teminator Arnie would have been proud.

[Beef]

I should think eSim would be embarrassed by the YouTube video. That is disappointing. Immersion is so important to me (to most of us) and paying as much as I did for the sim I would expect something like this to be addressed. You should do another video showing tree damage to crew versus a .50 cal rounds being pump into the hatch, or hitting the GPS and CITV. 

[Cougar11]

OK OK OK. this is a slippery slow here with the SB community or should I say the Beta tester, and workers. WE know that if we put up stuff showing the flaws(which I think we should or responsible people looking to the right thing by the game and developers would do), that they get defensive, and the anti click goes into motion against who or whatever group it is bringing it up. Make sure all post and discussions on this type of topic, or anything to the SB group stays constructive, and not confrontational even if you have to back down. I don't like it, but for the better of our group, future members, and the community as a whole please do.

Thanks 

[Admin]

As always. Discussion of any appropriate topic is encouraged. Bashing is neither encouraged or allowed.

[Asid]

I for one am disappointed.

It breaks some of the immersion for me. I use SB for its realism and immersion.

[Lumituisku]

 To me... nothing has really changed. Maybe only the fact that now I know my speculations to be true. Does it affect to me...  not really.

I would of course wish for grew to have hitbox but its not that much of a must.


I will still play like if I would get injured from machine gun fire or tree branches. And Im actually happy that this game doesn't punish me from being slow like slug to notice when Im fired or not safe.    I think that part of immersion is about the attitude. This is a game that makes playing possible. And by playing...  I mean that I have role as player. So yeah.. it makes it possible for me roleplaying as if I would be commander.    

[Asid]

 To me... nothing has really changed. Maybe only the fact that now I know my speculations to be true. Does it affect to me...  not really.

For me the lack of a "hitbox" is disappointing. Why? The fundamental environmental interaction is important. Lack of external crew hit box lessens the realism and immersion for me especially when this is a "tool" and not a game.

I use other simulations which model the "hitbox" for tank crews in a convincing manner and i can say it adds to the experience immensely.

   I think that part of immersion is about the attitude. This is a game that makes playing possible. And by playing...  I mean that I have role as player. So yeah.. It makes it possible for me roleplaying as if I would be commander.

That is a bit of a contradiction Lumi.....Invincible isn't immersive or realistic in this situation. However you are entitled to your opinion

Regards

[Lumituisku]

That is a bit of a contradiction Lumi.....Invincible isn't immersive or realistic in this situation. However you are entitled to your opinion

Regards

Well I do not play it like if I would be invincible... quite opposite. I'm careful like hell.. like ones should be on real life.. instead of just... being out of hatch since game makes it possible. I just find this game to be... Forgiving.