Steel Beasts Dynamic Terrain Will Come After New Terrain Engine

[Rinix]

http://www.steelbeasts.com/topic/11302-eta-on-terrain-patch/?page=10&tab=comments#comment-184008
All this time, I had a bad feeling about the silence from eSim Games. That bad feeling just got vindicated. This means that the new terrain engine will be more than 2 years overdue:

I say this with all possible caution, but the next window of opportunity for a public release of a major new update appears to be around the end of Q1, 2019.

 
 

 

And with these words I probably jinxed it.

[Asid]

All this time, I had a bad feeling about the silence from eSim Games. That bad feeling just got vindicated. This means that the new terrain engine will be more than 2 years overdue:

[Oleg]

I hope in the first quarter will be a complete update, not just a new land.

[Rinix]

I hope in the first quarter will be a complete update, not just a new land.

Yes, it will be a complete update. The new terrain engine was supposed to be delivered with 4.0, but it will come with new vehicles, dynamic terrain (craters and earthmoving), new grass and trees, and new lighting.

[Rinix]

And the Steel Beasts "community" is happy to let this happen: http://www.steelbeasts.com/topic/11302-eta-on-terrain-patch/?page=10&tab=comments#comment-184026

Still it’s good news.
Tx

[Rinix]

At time index 0:25:24, Gibson (under his YouTube name) says that eSim Games is overhauling most of the 3D models:
 

[Rinix]

In the comments for the 4.1 terrain preview video, Ssnake has made these comments. They don't say anything new about 4.1, and are in denial that there is any threat. All Ssnake does is repeat the same old canard about Steel Beasts' procedural simulation, which any competitor can duplicate if they put their minds to it. Keep in mind that these comments are 4 months old:

I'm fairly confident that on a modern multiprocessor CPU the performance drop in terms of framerate will be negligible. However, there's no way around the inflation of map sizes, which in turn has forced us to redesign elements of the user interface and the file handling in general - like the fact that we need to stream the terrain now, or the introduction of "map packages" that can only be used in network sessions if they are protected from further editing (you may however create maps that are based on the original and which consume considerably less disk space).

While I think that the YouTube comments section is fundamentally unsuitable for in-depth discussions, I don't want to let it go unanswered. In short, I just came back from this year's ITEC and saw SB Pro seen by our direct competitors are the technology leader when it comes to those elements that are most relevant for realism of procedures, and realistic outcomes. I will readily admit that other software has flashier graphics. But too many people are fixated on technology when they should ask first what's relevant for training. This results in a misdirection of development priorities. Now, when it comes to "games" specifically, that's a different case of course. But games are developed with a two to four year development horizon, and often enough completely from scratch. We are somewhat burdened with legacy code that isn't easy to shake, but at the same time two decades of uninterrupted development and refinement also offer unique advantages when it comes to the depth and breadth of the underlying simulation capabilities. 

[Rinix]

http://www.steelbeasts.com/topic/11302-eta-on-terrain-patch/?page=11&tab=comments#comment-184814
Interestingly, Ssnake says that the next version of Steel Beasts will be between 4.133 and 4.500. This means that my previous speculation on the then current version number was correct. Unfortunately, it's another disappointing post. After promising three separate times that we were going to to get the new terrain engine free, Ssnake has broken that promise and we'll have to pay to get it along with the rest of the next major release. Considering what Ssnake has said in the past, he's breached a contract with the civilian enthusiast market.

The version will be called 4.x (whatever "x" may turn out to be at the time, somewhere between "133" and "500"), not 5.0.

Yes, it will be an upgrade. It is undecided at this point how much we're going to charge for it. The exact release date is undecided. Once that we know, we will discount the price of the currently sold version 4.0 by a similar amount so that there is no deterrence to buy early.

Yes, if you buy it today, you will end up paying marginally more, but we have to draw the line somewhere.

The only reaction so far says it all:

I paid for the latest version as the landscape upgrade was supposed to be included in it.

Now I have to pay again to get what I already paid for?

[Asid]

Yes, it will be an upgrade. It is undecided at this point how much we're going to charge for it.

Really?

What about the people who purchased the last update because it was to include the terrain update?

[Cougar11]

Yes, it will be an upgrade. It is undecided at this point how much we're going to charge for it.

Really?

What about the people who purchased the last update because it was to include the terrain update?

Yes. What about those people?? This is a large factor in why I did not reinstall SB on my system when it went down. Really don't like the people over there that use their communication skills, the liers, and failed promises just to name a few. They can keep my money for the version that was suppose to have the terrain on it. I won't be buying it again.

Sent from my Moto Z (2) using Tapatalk

[Rinix]

http://www.steelbeasts.com/topic/11302-eta-on-terrain-patch/?page=11&tab=comments#comment-184820
Grenny misses the points, which are that 4.0 was expected to have the new terrain engine, and that Ssnake later promised us three separate times that it would be added for free. Sure, we already know that the next major release will have a lot more than just the new terrain engine, but that doesn't change what I said.

If 4.0 was only bought for the new-terrain, then this can be seen as a letdown i suppose?
Much happened in the last year(s), the next upgrade will include a ton more then the new terrain.

inexus isn't buying it from Grenny, but at least Gibson's response is reasonable:

It is an odd move to reduce the price of the current v4 to entice people to buy the new version coming up. That is honestly just completely ignoring people who paid full price already.

The price should be reduced on the new release for existing v4 customers to compensate us.

Usually the idea is so that people pay no more.

If you buy it say a month prior to the upgrade it might be US$100 (number used just for simplicity - I have no idea if that is the "right" amount).

Then the upgrade is released for say US$25 (again an arbitrary figure).

Therefore you'd pay: $100 + $25 = $125

Someone who didn't own a previous copy and just bought the new one would also pay $125.

The underlying approach being along the lines of "there is an upgrade coming so we'll discount the purchase price so you are no worse off".

The alternative is a scenario where someone buys it the days before release for $125 and then is required to pay $25 for the upgrade anyway.

Those people could rightly complain that they have paid $150 compared to someone who bought the "new" version a day later for $125.

Bond_Villain is wrong. Not buying the next major release will lock inexus out of multiplayer, making that decision completely impractical:

Dont worry, its not compulsory- you dont have to buy it  if you think the price is unreasonable or unfair or whatever.

At least Red2112 is asking about whether the new terrain engine was promised as free:

Wasen´t the new terrain engine to be (free) included with version 4 later on when it would be finished?  For those who bought version 4 of course...

[Rinix]

Ssnake gives his explanation: http://www.steelbeasts.com/topic/11302-eta-on-terrain-patch/?page=11&tab=comments#comment-184828

Yes, that was the plan. And we had every intent of fulfilling it. But first we discovered at only a relatively late stage that we had to redesign large parts of the file handling, which we expected to take six months (it was more like a year, as it turned out). This in turn made us miss a window of opportunity where we could have released it. After that point we had a number of contractual obligations to fulfill which absorbed so much of our capacity that we couldn't have managed a simultaneous release of a PE update.
As a result of the number of development contracts that we had to deliver in the meantime, and the ongoing general development process, so many changes have accumulated that we can no longer separate the high resolution terrain from all the other feature updates that are interwoven with the terrain.

Rest assured, we will calculate the price for the upgrade by considering all feature improvements except for the high res terrain to make up for this. At the end of the day, Q1/2019 is already two and a half years after the release of 4.0, and our goal is to release a major upgrade every 18...24 months. So, an upgrade is overdue.

[Asid]

Ssnake gives his explanation: http://www.steelbeasts.com/topic/11302-eta-on-terrain-patch/?page=11&

Rest assured, we will calculate the price for the upgrade by considering all feature improvements except for the high res terrain to make up for this. At the end of the day, Q1/2019 is already two and a half years after the release of 4.0, and our goal is to release a major upgrade every 18...24 months. So, an upgrade is overdue.

[/quote]

Again. What about the people who purchsed the original update because of the terrain upgrade? Now they have to purchase the new upgrade in order to get what they were originally promised.

This is starting to look like a big mess.

I understand that delays etc can happen but the people who originally purchased for the terrain are being penalised. The product is NOT as advertised 

Geez 

[Rinix]

Again. What about the people who purchsed the original update because of the terrain upgrade? Now they have to purchase the new upgrade in order to get what they were originally promised.

This is starting to look like a big mess.

I understand that delays etc can happen but the people who originally purchased for the terrain are being penalised. The product is NOT as advertised 

Geez 

Yep, and on top of that, the "At least one more free update" has still not been mentioned.

[Rinix]

Other than inexus, the Steel Beasts "community" is happy to let this happen: http://www.steelbeasts.com/topic/11302-eta-on-terrain-patch/?page=11&tab=comments#comment-184829

Thank you Ssnake. Fully understandable and I appreciate your detailed explanation, that´s very kind of you in doing so.  Hope this helps others understand the change in plans aswell.  Will just wait for the new year to move in to a new "garden" <S>