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Author Topic: The Battle for Belle Fontaine  (Read 11516 times)

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Offline choppinlt

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Re: The Battle for Belle Fontaine
« Reply #15 on: October 05, 2016, 03:15:50 PM »
Just to be clear with everyone, my main point is simply that TO will provide lots of player flexibility. I hope that point comes through with all my rambling. :)

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I am considering this from the perspective of the few umpired campaigns I have played in (part of a big one on the A Few Good Men web site right now) where the battlefield commanders have been given clear direction on the relative importance of force preservation and communication during the match up about pressing further, holding fast or withdrawing.

Yeah, that is a very cool arrangement. But your statement brings another point to mind. Once TO is up and going, there will be little/no requirement to have an umpire, depending on how players are wanting to play exactly. If players think they need an umpire for their game, then it would be a very simple job with all the automation TO provides.
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Offline Christian Knudsen

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Re: The Battle for Belle Fontaine
« Reply #16 on: October 05, 2016, 11:21:09 PM »
This is the beauty of the system that choppinit is building, it can be very adaptable.  We must remember that we don't necessarily want total control, even over one's own side!  For all that the commander of 1/115 IR told his A company OC to take it easy and make a demonstration, that company commander may very well have decided to press on, despite orders, to seize an opportunity.  Similarly, the umpire in Cat's game emphasized force preservation (knowing that pixeltruppens' lives are cheap), but probably had a few times where he/she wished that maybe a player had not pushed so hard, or had pushed a little harder. 

History is replete with examples of crappy commanders who spent lives needlessly in unrealistic pursuit of objectives.  For me, the beauty of a system like the one we are talking about here is that if the broader operations are reasonably balanced, then the players will be rewarded for finding a realistic balance between spending their forces and achieving objectives, between choosing a schwerpunkt and choosing the right schwerpunkt, between knowing when to press on and when to shift focus.
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Offline choppinlt

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Re: The Battle for Belle Fontaine
« Reply #17 on: October 06, 2016, 01:57:57 PM »
Thanks CK! Very well stated... I couldn't have said it any better!  ;D
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Offline A Canadian Cat

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Re: The Battle for Belle Fontaine
« Reply #18 on: October 06, 2016, 04:55:39 PM »
Yep agreed.  With what you are designing now you can go all the way from solo games against the AI (in both TO and CM) all the way to an umpire and a handful of operational participants with another group participating in the CM (or other system) tactical battles.

I see problems with having no umpire for some games in the near term since there is no current integration between TO and CM but if and when CM gets the ability to specify forces in a battle and report back the casualties then blind pay against the AI will be possible solo.  One step at a time.
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Offline Christian Knudsen

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Re: The Battle for Belle Fontaine
« Reply #19 on: October 07, 2016, 02:52:21 AM »
Gentlemen;

I'm currently involved in a really great discussion over at the Gamesquad forums which is raising some great issues, and possible solutions, for grafting a Lower Lever Game onto a Higher Level Game like ToO. 

http://www.gamesquad.com/forums/index.php?threads/the-problem-of-time-and-turn-limits-in-cg-scenario-design.128591/

Please check it out, and feel free to chip in.  Some of the discussion is geared toward ASL specifics, but there are some really good points that will impact porting any LLG into a HLG like Theater of Operations.

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Offline choppinlt

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Re: The Battle for Belle Fontaine
« Reply #20 on: October 07, 2016, 04:19:43 PM »
Agreed, that is a great conversation! Hopefully i will be able to chime in later today.  :)
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Offline choppinlt

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Re: The Battle for Belle Fontaine
« Reply #21 on: October 10, 2016, 07:19:12 PM »
The results from this engagement have been applied to the scenario narrative, and the Plan of Action for both sides has been updated as well. I *hope* to resolve the next turn within the next 2 days.

Thanks again CK for taking this battle on. This has stirred a lot of conversation on the gamesquad forum here http://www.gamesquad.com/forums/index.php?threads/the-problem-of-time-and-turn-limits-in-cg-scenario-design.128591/ that you can feel free to check out.

I plan to take some excerpts from that conversation and post them on this forum. Much of the discussion focuses on conversion to ASL, however there is some insight given that will be useful.
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Offline Tactical Wargamer

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Re: The Battle for Belle Fontaine
« Reply #22 on: October 10, 2016, 09:06:42 PM »
Great conversation.....reading the AAR. Nice work.
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Saturday Evening LAN Wargaming Group for the past 25 years 1900hrs Eastern Standard Time North America

Offline Christian Knudsen

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Re: The Battle for Belle Fontaine
« Reply #23 on: October 11, 2016, 01:46:25 AM »
Hey if you know anything about ASL, and can see any blunders I made, whether in terms of rules or tactically, let me know!
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